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Discussion Starter #1
Has anyone seen any difference using synthetic oil for their engines? In terms of fuel efficiency, engine noise, responsiveness, etc.

What about synthetic transmission oil? Would it be worth it? I heard you need to switch to synthetic before 48000km if one was going to change over to it.
 

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Use the 'search' feature of this forum.

Search for terms like "synthetic," "oil" and/or the various brand names (capitalized and spelled correctly).

There's been lots of diuscussion already on this common topic.

If you have an additional question, bring it up in one of those extensive threads.
 

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When I switched our 1990 Honda Accord EXR over from dino to Mobile 1, even my wife noticed a difference. She asked what I had done to the car for it felt to have more power. I thought I had noticed a subtle change, however it must have been more dramatic than I thought for her to have noticed. :)

I don't think there is a bad time to switch over to Synthetic, its just that the higher mileage engines may tend to leak the oil though the seals (no biggie)due to the lower consistence of the synthetic. I ran Synthetic in the Honda right up to the day I sold it (last week) @ 250,000 kms.
 

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I rather preffer a syntetic thing flowing inside my engine than a Dinosaur-soup :fluffy:

VipZ... I notice the change at my Renault's Scenic, even the ECU turn crazy for the first 50kms, because the loss of resistence, now it runs like crazy, It's also a modern engine with few kms on it so, no leak.

I'm also a a syntetic oil fan (worth the value).
 

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Discussion Starter #5
I have read the discussions in the other forums, but I wanted to know peoples view with their Xtrail. Was also curious if any xtrail owners are using synthetic in their transmissions.

Greg

Bror Jace said:
Use the 'search' feature of this forum.

Search for terms like "synthetic," "oil" and/or the various brand names (capitalized and spelled correctly).

There's been lots of diuscussion already on this common topic.

If you have an additional question, bring it up in one of those extensive threads.
 

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sorry, no synthetic at my XTy's tranny, it's not even a year old with very few kms on it, 'cause it's not my daily car & I live in a really small place.
 

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I don't think it's worth the price. I don't think you can tell much difference in engine wear before it turns over 200K and by then the synthetic cost you over thousand dollars extra.
 

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I switched mine to syn at 6k, noticed the difference in performance, fuel economy and the sound of the engine, definitely smoother. I use Mobil 1 and my dealer now carries it.
 

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Oreo said:
I have read the discussions in the other forums, but I wanted to know peoples view with their Xtrail. Was also curious if any xtrail owners are using synthetic in their transmissions.

Greg
I have Synthetic Oil in my BMW's Motor, Transmission and Rear Diff. I can tell you the cahnge was very much worth it.

When my BMW was new, I noticed the manual transmission felt very notchy and sometimes had a slight grind when shifting from 1st to 2nd as the weather got colder (Nov). A call to BMW indicated that what most owners do is swap oil types in the trans, during the winter, and then revert back in the summer. I thought this was crazy so I used Amsoil Synthetic Auto transmission fluid in the gear box, it is totally smooth with no swap required during the seasons. It took a few trial and errors as not all Synthetics were equal in the gear box. I used a Castrol Synthetic manual trans lube at first and it was actually worse than the Dino Auto Trans fluid that came out. The Amsoil and Mobil 1 worked the best.

Synthetic does not break down as rapidly as Dino over milage, or heat, thus you can really extend your oil changes with out worry if so required. Synthetic also has a more consistent viscosity over the entire range of hot and cold temperatures, thus it provides smoother starts in the winter cold, and can prevent higher engine temps in the summer. This can prolong enegine life on both sides be cause Synthetic flows more readily at cold temps, thus getting oil to the engine faster.

In the end I feel it does not matter what you use, the best protection is to change your oil often. I like the added benifets of Synthetic and have run it in my BMW from day 1 of ownership. I will also swap the X-Trail over to Mobil 1 when the first change is due.

Amsoil has this Micro filter system you can install on your car that micro filters the oil (~2um) so all you do is change filters a few times a year, yet the Synthetic oil remains in for a year or more. My one friend has this on his Van and truck and swears by it. He has had the oil analyzed after prolonged use and it's still good after a year or more, with very little break down in the oil and a low metal particulate count. You could never do that with Dino juice :thumbdwn:


Manuelga, I believe, for I have experienced it too :cool:
 

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If you car calls for an ATF for use in its manual transmission, I don't believe you can do any better than Specialty Formulations 100% synthetic MTF Glide:

http://www.specialtyformulations.com/index_files/Page2256.htm

It's formulated to be the same thickness (viscosity) as ATF as well as the oil's coefficient of friction. Much improved over an ATF will be its additive package.

It's always best to use an oil specifically formulated to lubricate manual transmissions instead of an ATF which is very low in anti-wear barrier additives.

ATFs will work, but they aren't optimal for syncromesh transmissions. They are designed for autmotic transmissions ... which are an entirely different breed of beast.

I use Specialty Formulations MTL-P (thicker than MTF Glide) in my SpecV's 6-speed. They have a total of 4 synchromesh fluids in varying viscosities which cover nearly all applications.
 

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Synthetic

On my Altima (killed by my wife in an accident...LOL she would kill me if she read that).. I had Castol Syntek for all of it's 450,000k on the engine.. and not one problem.

Even before I took ownership of the X-Trail I had them switch to Mobil 1 (Nissan recommended) and compared to my Boss who also has an X-Trail.. it is quieter and more responsive.

On another side note... living in Quebec.. we purchased (had built) our new home and after living through an ice storm... I said that I would never again live with out a generator. So my house was wired for it and I have a Honda Generator outside.. thankfully never to use it except once a week to start it and keep it running.

I have had it for two years... no problems and called Honda to inquire about Synthetic in this instead of the regular oil.. of course their line was no..without any explanation.

I did it anyways... replacing it with Syntec. I can tell you that two days ago I started it up and had it running for an hour... the noise level was much lower and it was running cooler.. their was less heat generated...so what did I do.. I switched all my gas tools to Synthetic... and I am glad that I did.

Stephen
 

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Bror Jace said:
If you car calls for an ATF for use in its manual transmission, I don't believe you can do any better than Specialty Formulations 100% synthetic MTF Glide:

http://www.specialtyformulations.com/index_files/Page2256.htm

It's formulated to be the same thickness (viscosity) as ATF as well as the oil's coefficient of friction. Much improved over an ATF will be its additive package.

It's always best to use an oil specifically formulated to lubricate manual transmissions instead of an ATF which is very low in anti-wear barrier additives.

ATFs will work, but they aren't optimal for syncromesh transmissions. They are designed for autmotic transmissions ... which are an entirely different breed of beast.

I use Specialty Formulations MTL-P (thicker than MTF Glide) in my SpecV's 6-speed. They have a total of 4 synchromesh fluids in varying viscosities which cover nearly all applications.
Thanks for the link, BMW specifically calls for various ATF fluids depending on the color of the tag affixed to the bell housing. Mine is a Green, which calls for Auto Transmission fluid. The Amsoil ATF I have in it works superbly from -40C to +40C, shifting is always smooth.
 

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SCHESBH, All my gas power equipment is either used in moderate-to-warm weather only ... or in a heated area when i have to start it. i use one of the many good 15W-40 oils on the market. Excellent in many respects.

But if I stored any of my equipment out in the cold, I'd use Mobil 1 0W-40 or Shella Rotella synthetic 5W-40. :)

ViperZ: "BMW specifically calls for various ATF fluids depending on the color of the tag affixed to the bell housing."

What they are looking for is (1) the thin viscosity of an ATF ... and possibly (2) an ATF's friction modifier package. Below is a listing of some of the thinner fluids used and their viscosity in cSt (centistrokes).


Red Line Oil MTL 10.5-11.5
Red Line High-Temp ATF 10.0
Specialty Formulations Synchroglide 9.5
Pennzoil Syncromesh 9.08
GM Syncromesh 9.08
Torco MTF 8.35
Specialty Formulations MTL Glide 7.5
Royal Purple Synchromax 7.5
Red Line D4 ATF 7.5
Amsoil ATF 7.2
OEM BMW ATF 5 - 6

For a comparison, 75W-90 gear oils are about a 15-16 cSt.

What no ATF has is a potent barrier anti-wear additive package (ZDDP, moly, zinc, calcium, etc ...). That's just the nature of any fluid made specifically for automatic transmissions.

So, even the best ATF will only have 2 out of the 3 things you want in a top manual transmission lubricant. That's what makes Specialty Formulations MTL Glide probably the best choice among the bunch of thinner syncromesh fluids. In the 7.5 cSt range, my second choice would probably be Royal Purple Synchromax. I'm not a fan of the brand but I'd bet it has barrier wear additives better than any ATF ... even Amsoil.
 

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Oreo said:
Has anyone seen any difference using synthetic oil for their engines? In terms of fuel efficiency, engine noise, responsiveness, etc.

What about synthetic transmission oil? Would it be worth it? I heard you need to switch to synthetic before 48000km if one was going to change over to it.
I switched to Mobil 1. I didn't notice an increase in milage right away. After 1000 miles there is definitely a difference. I used to get about 285 miles per tank now I get 340. I filled a 5 gallon tank and drove till I ran out before I changed it. I did it 2x. (probably not the best thing to do)

After I switched I did it right away and saw no difference. Did it again at 1000 and it made a difference. I still see the difference.


You can switch to synthetic anytime you want. Most of what you hear about synthetics are myths. Such as waiting to break in engine before using, leaking engines, cant use it past this time and so on. Change it anytime you want.

Had it tested at 9k and its still good. I changed it anyway but technically the oil was still good to go.
 

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I switched our X-Trail to Mobil1 at 6K - its first oil change. We were getting 10L/100km. Now, we're getting about 9.5L/100km. Nothing like the difference between 285 and 340 miles. That can't be all that accurate anyway, since it's hard to tell exactly how much is left in the tank.

The 5% increase in efficiency could be due to a number of factors, including a furhter broken-in engine, temperature, humidiy, driving conditions, etc., but we have experienced a slight improvement in fuel economy.

Performance improvement? Man, I can't see it, but then, I didn't buy an X-Trail to push the performance envelope.

But I'll keep using Mobil1 for the new X. It gets parked overnight in ski country, and I feel better, starting it with synthetic at -30C. We plan to keep this one for a long time.
 

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" ... the difference between 285 and 340 miles. That can't be all that accurate anyway, since it's hard to tell exactly how much is left in the tank."

Exactly, if you are trying to measure your mileage this way, you're kidding yourself. That's not nearly accurate enough to draw any conclusions.

You need to fill up your tank, write down the mileage or set the trip counter to zero. Drive until you need to stop again for fuel. Note the gallons it took to refill the tank (usually on the receipt).

Divide miles by gallons. This is your average fuel economy for that past tankful.

Put together at least 3-4 tankfulls in a row to get an idea as to how your vehicle is performing. Some vehicles (My SpecV) fluctuate greatly between tankfuls.

THEN make a switch (different brands, weights or 'types' of oil) and see if you notice a real difference. Don't change anything else (like tire pressures) as they have a great deal to due with fuel efficiency.

I record my mileage numbers/data on MS Excel. Takes about 15-30 seconds to enter the data once every other week or so. This is great to show the differences as the vehicle ages, goes through the seasons, etc ...
 

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Bror Jace said:
" ... the difference between 285 and 340 miles. That can't be all that accurate anyway, since it's hard to tell exactly how much is left in the tank."

Exactly, if you are trying to measure your mileage this way, you're kidding yourself. That's not nearly accurate enough to draw any conclusions.

You need to fill up your tank, write down the mileage or set the trip counter to zero. Drive until you need to stop again for fuel. Note the gallons it took to refill the tank (usually on the receipt).

Divide miles by gallons. This is your average fuel economy for that past tankful.

Put together at least 3-4 tankfulls in a row to get an idea as to how your vehicle is performing. Some vehicles (My SpecV) fluctuate greatly between tankfuls.

THEN make a switch (different brands, weights or 'types' of oil) and see if you notice a real difference. Don't change anything else (like tire pressures) as they have a great deal to due with fuel efficiency.

I record my mileage numbers/data on MS Excel. Takes about 15-30 seconds to enter the data once every other week or so. This is great to show the differences as the vehicle ages, goes through the seasons, etc ...

I dont think I am kidding myself or you guys but I guess you think I am. I know exactly how much gas was left after each tank,,, NONE. I am pretty sure I mentioned that I did it this way but I guess no one read that part. All I can say is. Before change. I drove it a few times until EMPTY I even kept a gas can in the back. Milage was within 285 miles. After oil change didnt make difference right away, much later it was an improvement. Tire pressure is checked weekly.

What else ccould I have done? Same exact driving conditions every time I did it. From a complete fill to empty and refil with same exact amount of gas over and over again. Drive til out, use 5 gallon can to get me going again. Do it again a week or so later etc.

If you dont believe the increase I got, I dont know what to say. If you have a suggestion as to what I did wrong, please enlighten me so I can get a more accurate reading without spending hundreds or even thousands on measuring equipment.


The Spreadsheet is a great idea. I hope I can find the paper I kept track of this on. If not I will start now. An can use excell ok but dont know crap about setting it up. Do you have a format or something you may share?
 

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Oreo said:
Has anyone seen any difference using synthetic oil for their engines? In terms of fuel efficiency, engine noise, responsiveness, etc.

What about synthetic transmission oil? Would it be worth it? I heard you need to switch to synthetic before 48000km if one was going to change over to it.

I have been using synthetic from the second oil change. I use MOBIL 1
and the factory oil filter. I have found better gas milege , more horsepower
and a quiter engine. I would definitly recommend it even if you were
going to change the oil at 8000 clicks.

I have been doing the oil changes every 12000. I was thinking of only doing the oil filter changes at 12000 and changing the oil every 24000.
 

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"I have been doing the oil changes every 12,000. I was thinking of only doing the oil filter changes at 12,000 and changing the oil every 24,000."

Think you'll save money doing this? How much ... $20-30 per year? That's foolish economy ... like the current F1 rules mandating 1 set of tires for racing and qualifying. :rolleyes:

Seems a foolish gamble to me. I wouldn't go over 8,000 miles on an oil and filter without testing along the way ... even using Mobil 1's newest "15,000 mile" oil. I can't imagine changing my oil at least twice each year ... no matter what a pain it is.

WildBoar, you mean you run your car until it quits? :eek:

An Excel spreadsheet is a LOT easier. ;)

Simply put your miles travelled in column A. On the same row, put your gallons consumed in column B. In column C, you'll write a formula:

=A1/B1

This will automtically divide the miles by gallons and show an answer. I suggest you format the cel to round to the nearest tenth. Numbers out to 4-5+ decimals suggest a precision you're not getting with this method of measuring. ;)

Repeat this using the next rows for each tankful of gas. :)
 
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