Nissan Forum banner

21 - 24 of 24 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
155 Posts
Tavel said:
um so which line is the return line, the big one or the little one? how much fluid does it take? (should i buy 1 gallon jug or 2 gallon jug?)

hydrolocks way just seems like its the right way to do it. its a flush of the system, not a drain and refill.

ill figure out which way i want to do it when i get in there, i've got both methods in my head...so whichever makes more sense when im down there.
Return line is the one with just a hose clamp on it. The high pressure line has a pressure fitting on it.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
33 Posts
To crank or not to crank?

Hydrolock:
The amount of fluid needed to flush well runs right about a bit over a quart to do it twice.
Thats not much. about $3.00. (Your question Tavel).
Just once using your method with the constant filling, having someone crank the engine for you which requires 2 people, not 1, and running a system that could be very dirty and cranking the hell out of the starter for again.. An inordinate amount of time based on system condition.
Not everyone has 2 people to help with this procedure, so how do you crank, watch for fluid color changes and keep an eye on the filling?
You could buy a "remote starter switch", but now you have to go and spend $10-$15.00 on one the typical guy may never use again.
Just to flush power steering fluid the "fast way".
What you are telling the average guy is that he wont get any airbubbles while he fills the system.. Ok, you could be right.. IF. You keep it full. And IF you keep adding fluid until it runs red at the drain on the return line and all of this IF you know what you are doing and looking for.
The average guy might not know when to stop cranking, he/she may also not know when the fluid is truly "clean".
Red is likely the "stop" point..but inexperienced people might not be able to know what the diff is from "lightly browned" or "faint" color reds from the point it begins draining! If the fluid is in fair condition, it might already BE RED!
Again, Its EXPERIENCE that makes the diff in your way of doing it.
How many cranks cycles? 1 or 2, 10 second crank cycles likely to do it?
People sometimes forget to wait 2 minutes between cool downs. Now, all of a sudden, if you do take the time to do a cooldown of the starter, you just added 4-6 minutes to your "Fast job".
Now, its closer to the same amount of time as what it takes to do the way Ive been talking about all along.
The other issues I mentioned in my last post.
Mainly because people may not be a bright as you are, THEY can MISS something.
Again, For instance, they only take out one of the 2 fuses, flood the system with fuel, possibly running their battery down from cranking, and again, overheating the starter.
Overheat the windings in a starter and you can crack the shellac surrounding them and you can get internal SHORTS or it might just keel over from that kind of potentially incessant cranking as well as wipe out the solenoid from the amp flow heating the solenoid power transfer disc to red hot and possibly damaging the starter drive due to bearing heat.
The typical crank time is 3-4 Seconds during a typical engine startup.. It takes 15 Minutes to Recharge a battery back to full in that short a time using the alternator.
This may also call for a battery charger to top the battery back up.
Can you guarantee the person doing the job is doing this procedure right?
No you cant.
If the method works for you, I think that telling everyone else to try and use your "easy" method may not be as good as when they can take an extra 10 minutes and do it safer.. and yes.. it IS the right method for the average guy and beginners!
Then you have the audacity to tell me to "read" your way of doing it because you think its some kind of "foolproof" method, and Im just a stupid moron and maybe you are a "Post" watcher and assume if Ive only done a small number of posts so I cant possibly know what Im doing. (No you didnt call me a moron or anything, but I get the feeling that you were thinking about it) all for telling people to do it a way that takes 10 more minutes than your way.
Lets just throw some caution to the wind.
Ive never seen a word in any of my manuals or any of my training that says use the "cranking" method to pump out fluid during a flush as you mentioned.
To be honest, you are supposed to use the same tool that the Transmission guys use. Its a Flush tank.
It does your method without the cranking.
Again, I like your thinking on getting the job done quicker, but you are using a method that simply isnt "by the book" as you say it is.
In my shop and tech manuals, they explain how to fill a powersteering pump and bleed the air, and to replace the pump, hoses and hardware the way I have done it for years on other rigs.
Some not as simple as the Nissans.
Since I dont have the flush tank, I have to do it the way I mentioned.
Even in your mind if it seems like a waste to do it my way, I argue that there is more at stake in not only doing it right, but by not cranking it over at all if you can possibly avoid it to prevent possible mishaps.
Just drain it out best you can, refill, idle the vehicle for maybe 30 seconds, turn the steering slowly left to right and then drain and refill and bleed the air one last time and recheck your fluid level.
What is so difficult about that?
The whole system uses close to 3/4 a quart to drain and refill. (each time).
Using your method, you still are adding fluid and draining it as its pumping fluid and ill bet the amount used is also very similar.
Ill say that Id rather spend $1.50 on a quart of transmission fluid, then potentially more on other parts.
Not trying to lock horns with you and you are obviously intelligent.
Methodology is mostly about experience of doing something again once you have had success the first time around.
And you had a particular experience, and I had my own.
Whatever works for you man.
Im certainly not telling you to do otherwise as you wouldnt likely use my advice anyway.
And yes.. I read your posts.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
155 Posts
Well whatever man, I'm done arguing this and it seems so are you. This is the way I've read it in my books and been taught. This is the way it makes the most sense. An unexperienced person can make mistakes doing anything though, no matter how simple it is to someone with more experience. It just kind of seems like you think my way is a trick or a shortcut, but it's not it's just the way it's done. Yeah there is more than one way to do it. You could drop your oil pan every time you did an oil change, but wouldn't it just be easier to take out the drain plug?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
33 Posts
I agree.. Time to let er go.

I totally agree.
I just figured it might be better to be cautious on what to tell newbies doin work. :)
Agree with your idea though.
I would never make the job harder than needed, as I actually try to speed up my work in certain tasks because ive done enough engine transmission jobs and other hardware replacements to know that you dont have to follow the manual to a tee.. And the tech manuals TRY to make suggestions that may or maynot appeal to all parties.
Manytimes, manuals suggest doing several other steps that have little to do with the area you are actually working.
Like, Ive seen some manuals say "remove the negative battery terminal" when you are changing sparkplugs. LOL
I guess they are going the side of caution for anyone that might be new to mechanics or whatever, that somehow they might arc a wire somehow to ground (it is possible I suppose).
I usually push caution in many things because they can be dangerous.
And you are right. We have different opinions on the same job. Nothing wrong with that. :)
Speaking of different opinions..
I remember getting a call for a lady that had an early 80s Ford with a 2.8 V6. Think it was a fairmont (gag).. anyway, she told me she needed a headgasket set.
I said, "we only sell the headgasket with torque to yield headbolts and you would have to order the headgasket if you only wanted that".
She said some crap about her Husband being a "master mechanic" and that kinda thing and that she "only needs a headgasket".
I asked her if her husband picked up some new TTY headbolts already and She said "no".
I told the lady that the Factory says you CANNOT reuse the bolts, as they will NOT torque correctly and you blow another headgasket and warp the head as they have already stretched and will not relax for re-torquing.
Any good mechanic resorts to the manual to check over procedures, and decides what he/she wants to do about the work based on thier experience level.
Well, she wouldnt have it.
I told her that there is no other choice, and you could just buy just a headgasket if I ordered one, but they were cheaper to just get the Headgasket kit with the TTY bolts.
She said "no", and I said that "I was just trying to give her advice based on my info on hand". They HIGHLIGHTED the stuff in my books that it was Critical to replace the headbolts!
Well, If the Guy was really all that good, you would call yourself so your WIFE doesnt accidently get the wrong stuff!.. LOL
Just made me think the guy wasnt anything special, and she was making things up to make it sound like he knew what he was doing.
I know some guys that have thier wives call because if they get a dude on the phone and they sound dumb somehow, they will have a nut or two removed in pride.
I see the logic, but man, If you are doin the work, most people in the service of working in any autoparts store will try and help you as much as they can (I was one of those) and maybe you can get that job done right. :)
I made a suggestion, a very good one and she ignored it completely.
Oh well. Not my rig, and I tried.
Sadly, many autoparts guys may not very knowledgable about mechanics and are just working a paycheck.
I tried to teach my guys and gals as much as I could.
We had a good crew because of that attention.
I sometimes got into some tech tiffs with some of the ladies that I worked with over years.
We had one lady that should have had a shlong.. Man, Butch as it gets.
She frequently ticked off alot of guys with her 'brusqe" attitude and she nuetered alot of dudes and many would never talk to her again for advice.
Anyway, Arguement aside Hydrolock, have a good one man.
 
21 - 24 of 24 Posts
Top