Love my Titan but some quality disappointments

dagger · Mar 24th, 2004, 04:27 PM

Have 3 weeks now on my Titan Crew Cab LE. Only options were mud flaps and carpets - just what I wanted. I'm a Ford truck man for many years and had just finished test driving the new 2004's. On a whim from some bits of positive press I heard about the new Nissan, I passed a dealer on the way home and decided to pull in and check them out.

Very impressed with the looks and many of the features. The Ford wins in some of the interior areas (I liked some of the materials/design choices as well as HMI control implementations), the Titan uses a bit too much chrome in the front end but other than that I gave the nod to Nissan for the overall looks/exterior design. What won me over was the driving experience - they both on paper have similar engines (300 vs 305 hp) but the Nissan blew the Ford away. Punched the Titan on an on-ramp and it effortlessly revved to 6K rpm. It felt much faster/responsive than the Ford and the ride was a bit better (though the 2004 F-150 is very close). I had to have this engine/truck.

A couple of hiccups buying from Nissan rather than my usual Ford dealer (expected some of this but I was spoiled by Ford), but closed on a deal I could live with (barely - ouch on payments for a $35K truck!). That said, I am disappointed with the quality so far - much below what I expected from a Nissan. It's been in the shop twice in 3 weeks. Here's the list:
- Loose antenna base - loud rattling when moved
- Trip odometer button stuck/not functioning
- 1 tailgate light out
- Left headlight out of alignment
- Sqeaky left door
- Truck bed floor rail extenders are loose and bang the cab/tail gate on stopping/accellerating
- Power seat entry/exit memory function has failed to return 8 times in 3 weeks
- Brakes feel too soft
- High frequency vibration in steering wheel felt between 28mph to 35mph during acceleration or deceleration

The last 4 items have not been fixed. The response from dealer service department on:
- the rail extenders is that in heat/cold they will expand or shrink and will slide - normal event
- can't reproduce power driver seat failing to return so can't do anything
- tested 2 other Titans on lot and brakes are the same so this is normal operation
- tested 2 other Titans and the vibration is there on those as well. Did not see any suspension/component installation faults so this is a normal operation

So 1 - sub-par initial quality experience for me. And 2- has anyone else observed any of the above 4 items on their Titan's? I can understand their rules on reproducing an error before they can work on it, so I'll wait on the driver seat issue. However, the other 3 I feel may be design flaws that I think should be addressed. Should I escalate?

Don't get me wrong - I still really like this truck, but it has been tarnished by a few initial poor quality items.

Cheers,
dagger

black_knight · Mar 24th, 2004, 06:12 PM

not many of us here have titan's but what you are going through is to be expected on a first year run. specially as soon off the line as yours is. And every car company experiences it. My friend bought one of the new 2003 Accords as soon as they came out and he's had various rattles, and small componentry not working as good as it should and it's a HONDA! The same happened to ford when they came out with that new 6.0 powerstroke... it was plagued with problems big time. Don't worry... some of those things are just things that weren't checked very closely (headlights out of adjustment, etc) I wouldn't worry to bad. Just think of it this way. if it was a domestic car.. the first year hiccups are usually: transmission failure, suspensions coming apart, engines catching on fire... etc. Nissan i'm sure concentrated on the powertrain and structural components that some of the details probably got overlooked... that's what happens when you come out with aroung 10 cars in only 3 years (inc. infiniti). I know my next truck will be a titan but definitely after they work the bugs out!

Later,

jadcock · Mar 24th, 2004, 07:50 PM

I would absolutely elevate those issues to your regional zone office. You paid good money for that vehicle and you deserve to have a quality vehicle in your garage every night -- one that doesn't rattle or vibrate or squeak. Once again, there's a mentality here that if something like this fails on a domestic, it's poor quality and engineering. But on a Nissan, we'll forgive them and give them a few model years to get the bugs out. Puleeze...

We've had many first year run vehicles in our lifetime (which have all been domestics by the way) and they've given incredible service. I wouldn't expect more or less from a Japanese brand. Everybody makes mistakes -- anomolies from the factory (like the mis-aimed headlight) can be forgiven with a quick readjustment at the dealership. Excuses like, "oh, those rails banging around are normal" are unsat, and I'd absolutely kick it up a notch if you can't get satisfaction from your dealership.

Blank · Mar 24th, 2004, 08:08 PM

that really sux about your truck man... though the comment on a 1st model year vehicle is spot on... sometimes little niggling details were not worked out... same as on my 02 spec v... its the price i pay to be the first...

dagger · Mar 24th, 2004, 08:41 PM

I know there is a risk with first year vehicles - I didn't want to do this, but they got so many things right that I was seduced. Still, their advertising literature talks up the amount of planning and testing and redesigning and compairing they did, and I believe them. Unlike Toyota and their Tacoma full size introduction - it took them a couple of retries to get competitive. The Titan is very competitive day one.

Nissan is obviously putting a lot of effort and pressure on their dealers about quality of purchase and servicing of their vehicles. I get letters, cards and questionaires and the salesmen and service reps all want me to answer Nissan's Q's with nothing but excellent or call them first. I'm going to take them up on this one.

Still hoping for other Titan owners to chime in to see if some of these are common or they are unique to my vehicle.

Thanks,
dagger

andrewclark · Mar 26th, 2004, 10:01 AM

Haven't had any of these issue yet. Never had a Ford truck to compare brake feel though. I traded in an Altima which had very precise feeling brakes but didn't think much about difference between it and the Titan because I thought it was apples to oranges. We do have a carolla though that has mooshy breaks since day one and my Titan feels great compared to it.

So far I'm loving everything about it.

farmer-dave · Mar 27th, 2004, 06:37 PM

I owned only one Ford truck, and it was the biggest lemon vehicle I ever owned. I guess I should have been suspicious when the headlight knob came off in my hand as I drove out of the dealership! At 60,000 miles Ford said bring it in, and they'd fix everything that was wrong, paint, mechanical, interior, etc. They had it two weeks. One week later, the driver's power window quit, and the antilock brakes failed. I got rid of it!

No such problems with my Titan LE so far. I bought the 2WD model loaded with everything except the navigation package (even satellite radio, very cool). My only complaint is the touchy throttle, something I knew before I purchased. When leaving a stop, it's too easy to lay a patch of rubber right in front of that cop on the other side of the intersection! Nissan should modify the throttle map on the drive-by-wire throttle, and retrofit all Titans.

Aside from that, I got a good buy ($2,000 under sticker) on what my father in law calls "the nicest truck I've ever ridden in". I get favorable comments on it everywhere I go.

1997XETruck · Mar 28th, 2004, 01:06 AM

You'll be surprised at how many of these issues get addressed as Nissan discovers that they're a trend. Reading through the TSBs on the D21 truck, and Q45s - they addressed everything, right down to some marks on the sunroof shade on the Q, and the search time with the radio in "seek" mode. Just make sure they know about the issues so that they get put on the list of things that need to be addressed.

Heath

aaronford · Mar 28th, 2004, 02:41 AM

Hey, sorry about the 1st year issues, but take comfort in the fact that I am green with envy. Later

Speedysam11 · Mar 31st, 2004, 02:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dagger

Have 3 weeks now on my Titan Crew Cab LE. Only options were mud flaps and carpets - just what I wanted. I'm a Ford truck man for many years and had just finished test driving the new 2004's. On a whim from some bits of positive press I heard about the new Nissan, I passed a dealer on the way home and decided to pull in and check them out.

Very impressed with the looks and many of the features. The Ford wins in some of the interior areas (I liked some of the materials/design choices as well as HMI control implementations), the Titan uses a bit too much chrome in the front end but other than that I gave the nod to Nissan for the overall looks/exterior design. What won me over was the driving experience - they both on paper have similar engines (300 vs 305 hp) but the Nissan blew the Ford away. Punched the Titan on an on-ramp and it effortlessly revved to 6K rpm. It felt much faster/responsive than the Ford and the ride was a bit better (though the 2004 F-150 is very close). I had to have this engine/truck.

A couple of hiccups buying from Nissan rather than my usual Ford dealer (expected some of this but I was spoiled by Ford), but closed on a deal I could live with (barely - ouch on payments for a $35K truck!). That said, I am disappointed with the quality so far - much below what I expected from a Nissan. It's been in the shop twice in 3 weeks. Here's the list:
- Loose antenna base - loud rattling when moved
- Trip odometer button stuck/not functioning
- 1 tailgate light out
- Left headlight out of alignment
- Sqeaky left door
- Truck bed floor rail extenders are loose and bang the cab/tail gate on stopping/accellerating
- Power seat entry/exit memory function has failed to return 8 times in 3 weeks
- Brakes feel too soft
- High frequency vibration in steering wheel felt between 28mph to 35mph during acceleration or deceleration

The last 4 items have not been fixed. The response from dealer service department on:
- the rail extenders is that in heat/cold they will expand or shrink and will slide - normal event
- can't reproduce power driver seat failing to return so can't do anything
- tested 2 other Titans on lot and brakes are the same so this is normal operation
- tested 2 other Titans and the vibration is there on those as well. Did not see any suspension/component installation faults so this is a normal operation

So 1 - sub-par initial quality experience for me. And 2- has anyone else observed any of the above 4 items on their Titan's? I can understand their rules on reproducing an error before they can work on it, so I'll wait on the driver seat issue. However, the other 3 I feel may be design flaws that I think should be addressed. Should I escalate?

Don't get me wrong - I still really like this truck, but it has been tarnished by a few initial poor quality items.

Cheers,
dagger

Hey Dagger,

You got off pretty good I think. I have sooooooooooo many problems with my new Titan Crew LE 2x4. Here is the List.

1. Sunroof was really noisy: Dealer adjusted the alignment, problem went away
2. Stereo: Intermitently making a LOOOOOOUD BUSSING noise, even with the stereo turned off: After 2 weeks of attempts and hearing aids: isolated the problem to be with the clarion amp under the seat.
3. Passenger seat rattling: Found the guides for the head rest were not installed properly
4. Power seat entry/exit memory function has failed: NO SOLUTION. VERY INTERMITTENT.
5. Rattling in the Dash: No solution yet. Still have to take the truck back in for the repair
6. Bed liner Pealing: No solution yet. Still have to take the truck back in for the repair
7. The Rockford Fosgate Stereo: The high pitch sound you get from the tweaters disapear when you drive off. But when you come to a stop, they reappear. This only happens whith the FM Radio mode. I had the radio replaced and still the problem is still there.
8. Rear Leaf springs Squeek: Dealr lubbed the springs: Still Squeek.
9. Everytime I go up/down driveways, press on the gas/brake, Loud "Clunk" sound from the rear of the truck: Dealer can't figure it out.
10 Brakes do feel soft too: Gotten used to it
11. the brake dust really sucks: Have to cleen the rims everyday: Very anoying

Even with all these problem, belive it or not, I still LOVE the damn thing. I just wish I didn't have to experience the faults tho... making $650 payments a month would go more with ease if I didn't have to go back to the dealer every other day trying to find solutions to these problems.

black_knight · Mar 31st, 2004, 11:57 AM

man even those problems sound small compared to the ones I had in my 2001 Silverado... check these out and you'll appreciate your 1st year nissan, and remember my silverado was 3rd year run.

I bought the truck new with 14 miles on it,

2k miles - Compressor started making horrible whining noise above 2k rpms. Dealer said that this was normal... gas mileage dropped by 2mpg in summer months.

3k miles - Cab of truck making a creaking noise everytime I come to a stop... Dealer said resulted from my toneau cover not going to fix it.

5k miles - Compressor getting louder, Cab creaking getting louder, loud rattling noise coming from under truck at speeds above 50 mph. Dealer says all is normal along with rattle in instrument panel.

7k miles - Knocking noise and looseness in steering column. Gas mileage really suffering driving at 75 mph unbearable because of compressor. Different dealer Replaces the steering box after a bolt sheared and finally replaces compressor after deciding it was defective and "lubed" the cab body mounts after I took off the tonneau cover and showed them the creaking was still there, creaking goes away temporarily.

10k miles - Transmission starts clunking randomly and has a very firm 1-2nd shift. Stereo quits working, Creaking returns. Dealer says transmission is normal and can't duplicate clunking. Replaces stereo and replaces cab body mounts.

15k miles - transmission still shifts rough and left door starts whistling at highway speed. Truck goes in the shop because radiator hose explodes and I walk out to go to class and there is a big puddle of antifreeze under the truck. Also engine starts vibrating the truck while idling enough to shake the seats and give me a back massage. Dealer says tranny is normal and they hear the clunking this time. Don't know what it is. Idling is a characteristic of the engine.

19k miles - tranny getting real bad... They finally discover that some sliding pin in a U joint or something jammed and wore out the u-joint not allowing it to absorb drivetrain stress causing the clunking and jolting. Dealer Services the rear-end and reprograms the transmission. Cab Creaking returns shortly after.

21k miles - Truck goes back into the shop and they replace cab safety cables which are almost worn through. And to replace driver side seatbelt which quit retracting.

and this was all in little over 14 months!! The idling problem never got fixed and that's what really lead me to get rid of it... that and the fear of the transmission falling out anyday and the fact that their first response to everything was IT'S NORMAL! So consider yourself lucky titan owners! LOL

By the way my boss's husband just bought a Titan 5.6SE 4x4 King Cab yesterday after comparing all the trucks out there and taking each one home for a night! I'll let you know how his experience goes!

Later, sorry for the long post!

1997XETruck · Mar 31st, 2004, 12:32 PM

Sounds like my 1990 Mercury Cougar. Clunking differential, leaking valve covers, leaking t-stat housing, 2 bad transmissions, oil consumption (1qt every 1800 miles), sagging door, bad sunroof gasket, irregular idle - all normal at 58,000 miles and three years old.

All "normal" according to the service manual and the factory...

I can't imagine buying American again now that there's a full size Nissan truck available.

Heath

dagger · Mar 31st, 2004, 05:03 PM

Heath - It's good to hear Nissan addresses most if not all issues. My assumption is that every line item on the service work order is received by Nissan and thus the issues are logged. That said, when they address these issues, is it only the next year model or are current models updated? I hope the answer is current vehicles get an update!

black-night - thanks, I'm feeling a little better about my Titan now. Funny, and no offense meant to Chevy lovers, but I even used that as a comment to the Nissan service department that if I wanted a new truck with a list of problems like this I would have bought a Chevy (they all chucked at that one).

Speedy - really sorry to hear about all your problems. And to others - some may be due to it being a "new" model, but others are common features that should be working correctly day one on any vehicle they produce - new or old model line. So you have an entry/exit power issue also - this should indicate an implementation bug and not just a single instance and thus we should expect a fix in the future. On #9 - since you have the LE you also have the bed rail extenders (rubber strips on rails on the bottom of bed) - the banging noise sounds similar to mine and those extenders slide back and forth hitting the cab/tail gate. My dealer said they all do it - I just installed a piece of rubber gas line hose in the track at the end of each rail => no more noise! And on #10 the brakes do feel a little softer than I'm used to so this may be just the way they are designed. I also agree with #11 - the brake dust is excessive - I hope it stops soon. Might be worth flagging it as a "problem" just to get it logged with Nissan?

One other new question to fellow Titan owners with Rockford-Fosgate audio system - until I used a CD, I didn't think the subwoofer was working. Is this similar operation to your audio/subwoofer performance?

That said, I still get shits&giggles driving it especially when I need to accelerate quickly. Lots of looks from people and comments. Just wish I could give an unreservered recommendation to this truck.

I'm going to escalate the 29-35mph vibration issue and the power seat entry/exit issue to Nissan Customer Relations on Friday.

Cheers,
dagger

1997XETruck · Mar 31st, 2004, 05:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dagger

Heath - It's good to hear Nissan addresses most if not all issues. My assumption is that every line item on the service work order is received by Nissan and thus the issues are logged. That said, when they address these issues, is it only the next year model or are current models updated? I hope the answer is current vehicles get an update!...

I also agree with #11 - the brake dust is excessive - I hope it stops soon. Might be worth flagging it as a "problem" just to get it logged with Nissan?

I'm not sure how they get the feedback. My guess is that they monitor the requests that the techs. call in for additional recommendations on how to fix things. I know that many TSBs were released on the Q45 and D21 trucks, and they typically were designed to address complaints for current owners - so if you ask about it, they'll fix it. Recalls only apply to safety or serious driveline issues.

As far as brake dust, I like brake dust! For the most part there's a scale that looks something like this:

dusty <-----------------------------------------> low dust
soft friction material <---------------------------> hard friction material
quiet <----------------------------------------> noisy
short stopping distance <------------------------> longer stopping distance
shorter replacement cycle <---------------------> longer replacement cycle

Of course the factory balances these as much as possible, but you'll tend to find dusty, shorter life pads on new models - with the factory making revisions to address customer complaints - and after the stopping distance numbers have been well documented in the magazines.

The 1990 Q45 came with OEM parts that made the assumption that the tires and brake pads would be replaced every 15000 miles - mirroring the premium (and much lower mileage) market in Japan. Everything performed wonderfully, but owners freaked out at $1000 in brake and tire maintenence. Later they hardened the pads up, and discontinued the special Michelin tires that were designed for the car. Longer stopping distances, but most customers seem happy.

Heath

jadcock · Mar 31st, 2004, 07:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by black_knight

and this was all in little over 14 months!! The idling problem never got fixed and that's what really lead me to get rid of it... that and the fear of the transmission falling out anyday and the fact that their first response to everything was IT'S NORMAL! So consider yourself lucky titan owners! LOL!

Damn, sounds like you got a lemon. But more importantly, it sounds like your Chevy dealership sucks, which sounds a lot like how some of the Nissan dealerships are. If your dealership was decent, stuff would have been fixed when it needed to. The first response of everything being "normal" sounds familiar doesn't it? Anyone say "Nissan"?

In fact, your experience sounds very similar to some of those here with new Titans. The problems aren't the same, but problems that don't get fixed and called normal are still problems that can be resolved and aren't. Remember, half of your experience with a particular brand and/or marque (if you buy it new) is dealership service.

I don't know how the Chevy dealership is here in town -- we've never had to take any of the Silverados in for service. The only "service" that's done is regular oil changes. And these are government trucks which do 50% of their driving off the beaten path. In fact, one of the '01s is in the body shop right now, undoing a wrong that I inflicted on it a few weeks ago. I was driving on a trail I know well, and there's a sharp crest on the trail. Our '01 is an extended cab long bed (4x4), so you can high center pretty easily -- and you do on this crest. You just have to have some speed so slide the thing over it. That transmission skid plate gets a workout. One day the other week, I didn't have the thing lined up perfectly and eased the right side of the bed of the truck along side a pine tree. Doh!