Originally posted by morepower2 My front suspension has about 8" of total front wheel travel, about 5" in compression and 3 in droop. I used a ultra thin energy upper bump stop and the foam lower bump stop. I have around 10" in the rear. What I mean about is making some assumptions on how much the bump stops compress.
I swear the ride is plush and it still leans considerably less than stock in the turns. AC in Florida sells Pathfinder swaybar quick disconnects. Most Nissan off road sights are linked to them.
Mike
Mike, can you elaborate on the mods to your front suspension? Is the only modification to the suspension the different bump stops? I searched through 4x4parts.com last night (that's AC right?) and only saw the rear quick disconnects for the pre-96 Pathfinders. They also have front ones for 96-later Pathys, but I believe these would be significantly different from the 95-down Hardbody/Pathfinder front suspension.
Originally posted by jadcock Mike, can you elaborate on the mods to your front suspension? Is the only modification to the suspension the different bump stops? I searched through 4x4parts.com last night (that's AC right?) and only saw the rear quick disconnects for the pre-96 Pathfinders. They also have front ones for 96-later Pathys, but I believe these would be significantly different from the 95-down Hardbody/Pathfinder front suspension.
Thanks,
Front suspension has Rancho 9000 shocks with the remote adjusting option, Nissan Motorsports torsion bars, Energy upper and lower control arm bushings, AC lower foam bump stops, Energy ultra low profile upper bump stops, AC idler arm brace, Rancho steering damper, Nissan Motorsports front sway bar and bushings, Spencer low idler arm bushings. The ride height is set so I am about 3/4 inch off the upper bump stop which is about 3" higher than it was (my stock torsion bars really sagged)
Stock the front suspension has 7" of travel which is increased by the lower upper bump stop and the much more compressable lower bump stop so I now have about 8". The suspension feels plush over big bumps, not harsh and hard bottoming like it did stock. The most extreme thing I did so far was jumping off curbs, didnt take it off road yet but its better on big bumps and hits than my Neighboor 3" lifted Procomp suspension S10 and his dads 5' lifted dual fox shock F250 SD so I guess its not too shabby. I think I could dust either of those trucks on a fast dirt road.
I didnt want to raise the car much because I like to drive fast on dirt roads pro rally style, I don't bolder crawl or do harder than intermediate trails. I don't want it to be tippy or highside, I want it to handle well and I am willing to sacrifice ground clearance to do it.
Mike
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Originally posted by morepower2 The ride height is set so I am about 3/4 inch off the upper bump stop which is about 3" higher than it was (my stock torsion bars really sagged)
Thanks for that elaboration. This is where my suspension seems odd to me. I don't have near that much travel, and I think they're supposed to be the same (Pathfinder vs. Hardbody). I wonder if my lower bump stop is not stock? As you can see from the diagram, I'm less than an inch from the lower wishbone bump stop and just over an inch from the upper wishbone bump stop, so it seems that I have no where near the same travel as yours does. I wonder what the major difference is. If my lower bump stop was a lot smaller, I could easily set the ride height higher to center it between the two stops. But as it is, I'm about an inch from the upper and I only have less than an inch between the lower as well.
I'm going to check out the foam lower stops from AC. I think I'll purchase those first. Got any experience/recommendations regarding the ball joint spacers? That seems like a good economical way to alter the ride height and suspension travel slightly while keeping everything mostly stock.
Originally posted by jadcock Thanks for that elaboration. This is where my suspension seems odd to me. I don't have near that much travel, and I think they're supposed to be the same (Pathfinder vs. Hardbody). I wonder if my lower bump stop is not stock? As you can see from the diagram, I'm less than an inch from the lower wishbone bump stop and just over an inch from the upper wishbone bump stop, so it seems that I have no where near the same travel as yours does. I wonder what the major difference is. If my lower bump stop was a lot smaller, I could easily set the ride height higher to center it between the two stops. But as it is, I'm about an inch from the upper and I only have less than an inch between the lower as well.
I'm going to check out the foam lower stops from AC. I think I'll purchase those first. Got any experience/recommendations regarding the ball joint spacers? That seems like a good economical way to alter the ride height and suspension travel slightly while keeping everything mostly stock.
Thanks again,
The think you might just have to simply crank up your torsion bars some? I think most people run them slightly past center towards the top out bump stop where yours seems to be just the other way. Remember, a small change here makes a big difference in travel because the motion ratio is around 2:1, so if you get it about 1/2" higher off of the pump stop, you gain over an inch of wheel travel.
I belive that the pathfinder and hardbody have the same front suspension with the main differences being torsion bar diameter and sway bar diameter.
The AC bump stops are taller than the stock ones but are intialy very soft, you can squish them with your hands. As far as ball joint spacers, I don't think you need them unless you are really raised up so as to where you are running the ball joints at a bad angle. I don't think mine is at that point.
Mike
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Originally posted by morepower2 The AC bump stops are taller than the stock ones but are intialy very soft, you can squish them with your hands. As far as ball joint spacers, I don't think you need them unless you are really raised up so as to where you are running the ball joints at a bad angle. I don't think mine is at that point.
Okay, thanks. I looked at the AC bump stops (the big foam ones) and you're right -- they're at least 1/2 taller than my rubber ones (I don't know if mine are stock or not, they're 2" thick). I didn't initially think those would work good, but remembered about the option for thinner upper stops.
I'm going to get either the ultra low- or low-profile upper bump stops from Energy (what is the P/N that you have, if it's not too much trouble to find, I found many P/Ns on their site and want to make sure I get one that will work properly). After I do that, I'll set the torsion bars to about 3/4" off the upper bump stop and see where I am at that point. As yours sits, with the AC foam lower stops, how far is your lower bump stop from the frame pad? I'd like to get a baseline to work off of.
Originally posted by jadcock Okay, thanks. I looked at the AC bump stops (the big foam ones) and you're right -- they're at least 1/2 taller than my rubber ones (I don't know if mine are stock or not, they're 2" thick). I didn't initially think those would work good, but remembered about the option for thinner upper stops.
I'm going to get either the ultra low- or low-profile upper bump stops from Energy (what is the P/N that you have, if it's not too much trouble to find, I found many P/Ns on their site and want to make sure I get one that will work properly). After I do that, I'll set the torsion bars to about 3/4" off the upper bump stop and see where I am at that point. As yours sits, with the AC foam lower stops, how far is your lower bump stop from the frame pad? I'd like to get a baseline to work off of.
Thanks again,
I forget what the part number was, I ordered them from Energy directly. I don't have the car here but the height was about 3/4" off the upper stop and 1/2" off the lower. The lower is taller but its very soft and squishy.
This weekend I put in the reomte shock adjuster kit. The Rancho shcoks have gotten stiffer with some use and I have to adjust them softer. The triple tube design pumps any air to the outer tube and I belive the shocks had air throuout the tubes since they were lying sideways. It toook a couple of days use to pump the air to the outer tube and now they are much firmer. I proably have to soften them a few clicks.
Spencer Low racing has a trick steering system that eliminates bumpsteer, eliminates the funky loose feeling center link design and is unbreakable.
I might go to this and their stage 5 system later. The stage 5 system has fabricated box section arms, zero bump steer geomtery, remote resouair shock, has 12" of wheel travel and widens the track 3". I am getting sick ideas of a Pro-Rally Pathfinder now.
Mike
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Master of Level 9
Last edited by morepower2 : Oct 9th, 2003 at 09:06 PM.
Originally posted by morepower2 I forget what the part number was, I ordered them from Energy directly. I don't have the car here but the height was about 3/4" off the upper stop and 1/2" off the lower. The lower is taller but its very soft and squishy.
Got it. I figured the lower foam stop would compress at least an inch pretty easily, so I used 1-1/2" as the height for that instead of 2-1/2", like it actually is. I'm excited to get the new stops and to adjust the ride height to about 1/2 to an inch higher.
I'll go searching for that Spencer Low Racing steering solution. I've seen Calmini's before and it looks high quality, but it's also high dollar. I'm sure SLR's is at least as much. I guess if you wanna play, you gotta pay.
I know I can build a VG30E with 260 hp and 240 lb/ft of torque which is more than a 5.0 Ford or a 4.6 SOHC modular motor which comes in many half ton trucks. It just might work and save me a bunch of money and space.
Mike
Please tell me more about this. I need more power! What mods would make for a 260hp/240tq VG30E? Any information would be great!
LM
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Originally posted by Mansier I know I can build a VG30E with 260 hp and 240 lb/ft of torque which is more than a 5.0 Ford or a 4.6 SOHC modular motor which comes in many half ton trucks. It just might work and save me a bunch of money and space.
Mike
Please tell me more about this. I need more power! What mods would make for a 260hp/240tq VG30E? Any information would be great!
LM
A low buck motor would be to use Q45 VH45 pistons in a VG33E blockwhich gives about 9.7:1 compression up from 8.8:1 and are 88mm bore for 3.4 liters. Do a little pocket and match porting, use JWT cams and run SLR or Doug Thorley Headers, top off with a JWT ECU. Run a 2.5" mandrel bent exhaust with peforated core straight through mufflers. Use JWT's POP charger filter replacing the rubber zip pipe with a smooth mandrel bent piece and makes a cold air dam in the engine compartment. This gives just under 260 hp.
For towing it might be better to run Nissan Motorsports 262 cams and give up a few top end hp to get better midrange torque.
NASA rules!
Mike
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Last edited by morepower2 : Oct 9th, 2003 at 09:09 PM.
Thank you! So the same heads, but with the 262 cam. Same rods as the VG33? Everything is a shortblock VG33 but the pistons right? Great! If I could even get just over 200hp with a bunch of torque I would be thrilled. I know what I'm doing when I get back from the track this weekend!
LM
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mansier@racenasa.com
Originally posted by Mansier Thank you! So the same heads, but with the 262 cam. Same rods as the VG33? Everything is a shortblock VG33 but the pistons right? Great! If I could even get just over 200hp with a bunch of torque I would be thrilled. I know what I'm doing when I get back from the track this weekend!
LM
Basicaly you want to put a VG30 crank, oil pump and front pulley in a VG33 motor. This is so your accesory drives stay the same because the nose of a VG30 crank is smaller and the pulley diameter and offset is way different.
The real trick setup is to machine down the VG33 nose slightly and bore up the VG30 pulley slightly so you gain the advantages of a bigger nose (the VG30 tended to bend if you went off on it to much) A lot of the class 7 off road racing guys do this but this is getting minorly esoteric.
Even quick and dirty with no headwork and the 262 cams the hybrid VG makes over 220 hp and nearly 250 ft lbs of torque. Running with 87 octane is borderline so you probably have to tow running 92 but you can run around normaly on 87. That power is in the leage of a 5.0 liter ford or the 4.6 modular motor found on 1/2 ton trucks.
Mike
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Originally posted by jadcock Got it. I figured the lower foam stop would compress at least an inch pretty easily, so I used 1-1/2" as the height for that instead of 2-1/2", like it actually is. I'm excited to get the new stops and to adjust the ride height to about 1/2 to an inch higher.
THe upper stops are a PITA to do, gotta put a long box wrench in their and turn them out by hand then tighten like 1/8 turn at a time.
Remember I was telling you about the shocks getting stiffer with use? I ended up going down to 3 front and 2 rear to get the plushness back.
The suspension is pretty amazing, you can hang turns like a car, in fact I think this Pathfiner probably pulls like .80 g's in a turn. I am pretty surpised, its actualy fun to drive and I am a big time SUV hater. I don't think it will flip unless she highsides.
My wife is having fun, trying to get people to follow her closely on streets where she knows there are big dips, hitting them without slowing down and watching sparks from the other cars undercarrages fly in her mirrors.
Mike
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There can only be one Icy Hot Stunta, Don't Hate.
Originally posted by jadcock Thanks for that elaboration. This is where my suspension seems odd to me. I don't have near that much travel, and I think they're supposed to be the same (Pathfinder vs. Hardbody). I wonder if my lower bump stop is not stock? As you can see from the diagram, I'm less than an inch from the lower wishbone bump stop and just over an inch from the upper wishbone bump stop, so it seems that I have no where near the same travel as yours does. I wonder what the major difference is. If my lower bump stop was a lot smaller, I could easily set the ride height higher to center it between the two stops. But as it is, I'm about an inch from the upper and I only have less than an inch between the lower as well.
I'm going to check out the foam lower stops from AC. I think I'll purchase those first. Got any experience/recommendations regarding the ball joint spacers? That seems like a good economical way to alter the ride height and suspension travel slightly while keeping everything mostly stock.
Thanks again,
I rasied the car somemore and am now about 1/2 inch off of my upper bump stop with no evidence of bounding off the upper stop. When researching on some Pathfinder boards, some guys raise it towithin 1/4 of an inch but that might be a little much.
Got my alignment all set but I can only get 3/4 of a degree negative and a couple of degrees positive caster and a touch of toe. In a hard turn it understeers at first and progresses to slow oversteer.
I think you can definatly raise your truck at least to this point safely.
Mike
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Originally posted by Mansier Thank you! So the same heads, but with the 262 cam. Same rods as the VG33? Everything is a shortblock VG33 but the pistons right? Great! If I could even get just over 200hp with a bunch of torque I would be thrilled. I know what I'm doing when I get back from the track this weekend!
LM
Exactly the pistons and cams are the biggest bang for the buck. The shortblock needs to get your stock pully adapted to it by turning down the crnak snout and boring out the pulley so your accsory drives fit.
Either that or use your VG30 oil pump, pulley and crank.
Mike
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There can only be one Icy Hot Stunta, Don't Hate.
Originally posted by morepower2 I rasied the car somemore and am now about 1/2 inch off of my upper bump stop with no evidence of bounding off the upper stop. When researching on some Pathfinder boards, some guys raise it towithin 1/4 of an inch but that might be a little much.
I just put mine to just about centered between the stops now, with the new low profile upper stops (see details and pics here http://jadcock.oldsgmail.com/nissan/...ars/index.html). When I order the AC foam lowers and install them, I'll probably re-center everything between them then, since the foam ones are a bit taller than stock. I figure I'll then be about an inch taller than factory height probably, with improved suspension travel and isolation (with that foam lower) and room for 31" tires when the current ones wear out.
