Just use the breaker bar method. You're not actually putting any un-needed stress on the starter motor. Just a simple tap and the bolt is backed off.
Of course if you have air tools, none of this would apply, as an impact wrench is the preferred method, anyhow.
By breaker bar method, do you mean (1) putting a 27 mm. socket on the end of a breaker bar and letting the breaker bar rest against the floor and then temporarily turning the ignition key (fuel pump purged and deactivated) so that the starter motor generates a torque against the crank bolt and loosens it?
Or do you mean (2) simply attaching the breaker bar to the crank pulley bolt head and giving the bar a wack so that the shock loosens the bolt? In this case, I assume that all the internal parts attached directly or indirectly to the crankshaft are at risk of being pushed backwards in the direction opposite to their natural rotation.
Owners of some manual transmission cars pay attention to what gear (reverse versus 1st) they choose when parking uphill versus downhill. The idea is to assure that the rotation of the motor resulting from gravity attempting to pull the car down the hill against the compressive forces of the valve springs will be the same as the natural rotation of the motor. If the motor gets forced to turn opposite to its natural rotation, the fear is that the valve timing belt will jump a notch, since the belt tensionner and geometry are optimised for one direction. Of course the GA16DE engine uses a timing chain and not a belt, but sprocket teeth can wear in one direction and it is not impossible to imagine that the chain could jump a position if the impact is strong enough and the chain tensionner is weak enough.
With method 2, the pinion gear of the starter motor will always be retracted, so we cannot count on it to provide any additional assistance in locking the crankshaft while we pry against it with our breaker bar.
If an air powered impact wrench is used on a seized bolt, would the air gun also drive the crankshaft in an unnatural direction just like a breaker bar should the bolt refuse to budge?
I mean the first method, of course And TBH, I really don't think the bolt would refuse to budge. You're exerting A LOT of force on the crankshaft NOT to get that bolt loose. The worse thing I can think of would be shearing off the bolt, which I would also doubt, due to the density of the bolt.
Lets put it this way, you would have to imagine that they are erring on the side of caution when they manufacture the car, so they would take into account any "un-natural" possibilities, like the crank pully seizing due to a component failure.
Besides, I've done it and had zero difficulty doing so. The only issue I encountered, was pulling the pully off of the shaft, which actually wasn't that difficult if I had just pulled evenly while squared against the pully. Popped right off once I realized I would have to lightly "jiggle" the pully as I tugged it off
I really don't think the bolt would refuse to budge. You're exerting A LOT of force on the crankshaft NOT to get that bolt loose.
I was reading the FSM for my 1.8 Toyota motor and noticed that they use a fork shaped bar which attaches by two bolts to the two holes in the crank pulley. It looks so simple, one could probably build a similar model using two steel bars and a couple of nuts and bolts. Another idea I came across on the internet calls for using a chain vice around the pully, first protecting the grooves with a layer of old V-belt. As you can tell, I'm resisting the idea of using the starter motor to unlock the bolt.
Quote:
Originally Posted by TeKKiE
The only issue I encountered, was pulling the pulley off of the shaft, which actually wasn't that difficult if I had just pulled evenly while squared against the pully. Popped right off once I realized I would have to lightly "jiggle" the pully as I tugged it off
By "jiggling" the pulley, do you mean you should or should have not made sure that the puller was held on square with the pulley's surface. If both 6 mm. bolts are screwed in tightly, then when you turn the center bolt on the puller, the pulling force will be applied directly on axis. But if you slightly slacken one of the 6 mm. bolts, then the pulling force will be applied slightly off axis and that will create a jiggle if you repeat the process by constantly switching which bolt is slackened.
I didn't use a pully puller. Just my hands. The pully puller I had didn't have small enough bolts, so I just started to jiggle a lil bit and it came right off with my hands.
IMO you REALLY don't have anything to worry about, just using a breaker bar to back off the bolt. If you read thru this entire thread, you'll notice a majority that have changed their seals used the same method.
Besides, if you DO in fact damage your starter in any way (not likely), you can get one from a junk yard, still cheaper than it would cost you to buy air tools, or take it to a mechanic.
I didn't use a pulley puller. Just my hands. The pully puller I had didn't have small enough bolts, so I just started to jiggle a lil bit and it came right off with my hands.
That's amazing, being able to pull it off without any tools.
Quote:
Originally Posted by TeKKiE
If you read thru this entire thread, you'll notice a majority that have changed their seals used the same method. .
I do see how popular this technique really is, and it has been mentioned on other car forums.
Quote:
Originally Posted by TeKKiE
Besides, if you DO in fact damage your starter in any way (not likely), you can get one from a junk yard, still cheaper than it would cost you to buy air tools, or take it to a mechanic.
Somehow, I'm more worried about breaking a tooth on the flywheel than the starter pinion gear, but I see your point. I've had such bad luck with bolts over the years. There are times when I wished that I had resealed the major bolts with anti-seize compound when my cars were new so that 6 to 8 years later I could work in confidence.
I was taught that every part on a bicycle should be greased, with the exception of three. Unfortunately, when a car passes down the assembly line, the workers don't dip each bolt in lubricant before installation.
Would anyone mind reposting the images from the first page, or directing me the seal replacement procedure in the FSM?
Gracias.
Put the car up on jackstands. Disconnect negative terminal of battery (You really should do this anytime you're under a car, IMO). Remove the right wheel well plastic cover (splash shield). Remove the front right splashguard. Loosen the tensioners for the AC belt and the PS belt. Loosen the top alternator bolt and disconnect to allow for easier leverage. LOOSEN, not remove, the bottom bolt to the PS pump to allow for leverage. Pull belts off of vehicle. Use an impact wrench w/ 27MM socket (Impact socket) to back off the bolt holding the main pulley to the crank shaft. Don't have air tools? No problem! Reconnect negative terminal of battery. Take 27MM socket with at LEAST 24" breaker bar and attach socket to bolt. Rest the breaker bar end up against the front of the control arm. Pull the fuel pump fuse. Ensure a good solid connection of the socket to the bolt, and to the control arm. Attempt to start car JUST LIGHTLY TAP, DON'T LET CRANK FOR MORE THAN HALF OF A SECOND. Bolt should be loose as a goose. Remove bolt, and gently pull (you should be square against the pulley) the pulley off. It will take a while, but make sure you don't use a tool to try and pry it. You could damage the pulley easily if you attempt to remove by prying. Jiggling works as well. Just be gentle with it.
Once off, use pliers or flathead screwdriver, or awe to remove bad seal. Careful not to scratch the inside surfaces where the seal sits. Coat new seal with light coat of oil, and use a rubber mallot, or an oversized socket to put seal back in. Make sure you don't put seal in crooked. Seal should be flush, or a hair or two inside the port. Don't push in too far, or leave hanging out. Then re-install everything in reverse. Make sure you don't lose the key from the keyway on the crankshaft, or you'll need to buy a new one. Mine was attached to the crankshaft, so no worries. Not all should be this way though. Just make sure you take your time to do everything slowly and methodically.
When you're done, do a once over and re-check your bolts for alternator and PS pump. Make sure they're tight, as well as the tensioners being re-tightened.
Insert fuel pump fuse, and crank her up. Check for oil leaking. Belts should loosen up a bit, make sure you re-tighten them. Once they're good and tight, fire it up again and make sure everything's good. Then replace your plastic splash guards, and take it for a test drive
Originally I thought my oil leak was most likely coming from my wife's car oil pan gasket.
I found a photograph of the front of a Sentra motor and I colored in all the locations on the photograph where there was oil on the actual car. I took the photo to a Nissan dealership and their mechanic agreed that it was most likely a front seal. He advised me to clean up as much of the oil as possible so that any new oil would be more easily tracable.
I also shopped around for another solution on how to immobilize the pulley on an automatic transmission car so that a breaker bar could be used to remove the center bolt. Here are some of the ways it can be done:
1) find a specialized tool to attach to the pulley,
2) use the starter motor to turn the pulley against a breaker bar locked in position,
3) remove the starter motor and insert a chisel into the flywheel teeth,
4) insert a wooden wedge in between one of the pulleys and the alternator belt so that the wedge acts like a cam that blocks the movement of the belt, and presumably the pulleys as well,
5) use an impact air tool not requiring the pulley to be blocked.
The only specialized tool that I could identify was a OTC pulley holder model 4754 which the company confirmed would probably resist 500 ft-lb of torque, but the accessory pins were too short and too thin to work with the 6 mm. holes in the recessed bowl of the pulley.
The Nissan mechanic Ok'd the use of the starter motor, but did not like the idea of wedges on the belt, or a chisel in the flywheel teeth. The auto parts/repair center liked the idea of the wedges and the chisel, but not the starter motor.
Everybody liked the idea of an air tool.
Once I realized that the dealer would replace the front seal for a fixed charge of exactly 1 hour of shop time, I decided that was the best route to take because it freed me up from having to choose one of methods 1 to 4 and I did not have to worry about a hub puller stripping the threads on the two 6 mm. holes in the pulley, which I consider to be undersized should we be faced with a pulley seized on the crank shaft. The Nissan mechanic said he preferred using two curved bars to pry out both sides of the pulley using the engine block as a fulcrum for each lever.
I bought the seal ahead of time at the same dealership. The dealership also returned the old (8 year old) seal, and it was quite stiff.
The lesson I have learned is that once oil gets on the pulley from athe front seal, centrifugal force and the underhood wind will drive it to the most extreme locations which can easily confuse the car owner as to the original source of the leak. I also learned that even though the money saved by doing something yourself can finance the purchase of one's specialized tools, paying a dealership to do something can buy a form of insurance against situations where a bolt gets broken during removal and a costly thread extraction procedure must be performed by the dealership, where the dealership has already committed to a fixed price for the complete task.
The dealership also returned the old (8 year old) seal, and it was quite stiff.
I took another look at the old seal and it is stiff on the outside due to a rigid ring. However it is still soft on the inside indicating that with time, the rubber did not harden up. This soft rubber did wear away enough to allow oil to escape.
So when you purchase a brand new seal, don't be surprised to discover that the seal is composed of two layers of rubber with different stiffnesses.
wow the breaker bar method is the best thing in the world. first try and bam the bolt was loose and not only that but the pully came right off took about 1/2 hour to do it all...my next task in the summer time is the timing chain....i'll make a how to maybe....
This thread has been really helpful, oil is coming out pretty fast and after a clean up the culprit is clearly the front crank seal. The car we have is an auto and the info you've all left here on how to do this job has been invaluble. I have an impact driver so i'm going to be ok getting the pully bolt off but how did you guys lock the crank to be able to get the pulley bolt back on and torqed? I was changing the discs and pads yesterday so i had a look at it and it spins both ways.
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