Another B13 rear STB

jp314 · Nov 7th, 2002, 05:34 PM

I modified Omer Khan's B13 rear strut tower brace design.
The bracket is very similar, but this design has a block
welded below the bracket, with a threaded hole low enough
so you don't have to cut any sheet metal.
This prototype is only spot welded in a few places, just
to check the fit.

Here is a link to some pictures:
http://www.geocities.com/jjpalmer314/b13rearstb.html

The brackets and blocks are steel because that was what
we had in stock. The center bar is aluminum, 1" hex.
I'll probably make another one with aluminum brackets
and blocks, to save weight. The center bar should be
rigid enough with a 7/8" hex bar - I'll probably make
one to test it.

If anyone is interested, I'll make them, at our cost,
which will depend on how many people are interested.

Josh Palmer
1993 SE-R
Materials Mgr / MIS Mgr / Estimator
Quality Machining Inc (www.qmiwi.com)
1001 Uniek Dr.
Waunakee, WI 53597
608.849.8057 Voice
608.849.8957 Fax

PhattyB13 · Nov 7th, 2002, 06:51 PM

whats a ball park figure on how much they would cost...

also is the rear seat still able to go in place???

Pretty White · Nov 7th, 2002, 07:41 PM

Thats a nice bar. It looks a lot like the Motivational bar for the NX2000 I have.

Nov 7th, 2002, 08:40 PM

Im interested, How much?? Will it be completely polished or painted?

toolapcfan · Nov 7th, 2002, 09:43 PM

I might be interested, I have the same questions as PhattyB13.

NismoXR · Nov 7th, 2002, 11:40 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Pretty White
Thats a nice bar. It looks a lot like the Motivational bar for the NX2000 I have.

Hey do you know if they are still selling them? I know im behind the times, but did they go out of business?

jp314 · Nov 8th, 2002, 08:56 AM

As far as finish goes, with an all aluminum brace, I'll just leave the finish as is. With steel brackets, I could get them zinc plated, without too much more expense.

Here's a copy of an e-mail I just sent to the se-r list:

> From: "Kevin J. Hart" <bowlcut@comcast.net>
> But will the seat fit back over that bar without any modifcations? And how
> noticeable is it? Omer's seat goes on no problem and the bar isnt
> noticeable

The seat fits back in place fine. You don't notice
it's there, unless you push back into the seat real
hard - It would probably be the same with Omer's.
Omer - care to try it?
The bar doesn't stick out past the 'seat mount
flange' much at all. I'm also going to use 7/8" or
3/4" hex in the final design.

> From: RCKTPWR@aol.com
> Has anyone actually put one of these bars on, and if so, have you felt any
> difference in the handling?

I have only driven home and back to work since installing
it, so I'm not sure yet.
Read this thread:
http://www.sr20deforum.com/showthrea...threadid=28785

"These make a pretty big differance. The rear of a b13 is about as stiff as a noodle. A sun roof makes it even worse." - Joel W. (random thoughts)

"You are exactly right. It made a *very* noticable difference. The car understeers much less and will hold a line much better. I can even get the car to drift now rather than plow, but the rest of my suspension obviously helps with that also."
- Omer Khan

> From: Butterglry@aol.com
> does the sheet metal bracket have to be 3/8 or can i get away with 1/8
> stainless?my konig front bar is pretty thin so i really dont see the need
> for the extra weight.

I used 5/16" thick with counterbored holes for the flange
nuts because that's the closest size we had in stock.
The final design will be 3/16" or 1/8" steel, or 1/4"
aluminum with c'bored holes for the flange nuts.
Also, look at your front bar. If it's like the 'Courtesy'
front STB, the brackets are stampings, with formed ridges.
These add a lot of strength, allowing the use of thin
sheet metal. The center bar is solid aluminum hex bar,
it is pretty rigid.

Estimated weights for complete brace:
Steel brackets, blocks:
w/ 3/4" hex Al bar = 6.5 lbs.
7/8" = 7.3 lbs.
1" = 8.2 lbs.
Aluminum brackets, blocks:
w/ 3/4" hex Al bar = 3.9 lbs.
7/8" = 4.7 lbs.
1" = 5.6 lbs.

The first one was made on manual equipment, with higher
quantities, we'll use the CNC's and will be much faster.
Ballpark pricing so far:
5 @ $85, 10 @ $65, 25 @ $55, 50 @ $50.
I think we can make them for less - if there's enough
interest, I'll have the CNC programs written and have
a better estimate on the price.

Josh Palmer
1993 SE-R

toolapcfan · Nov 8th, 2002, 09:35 AM

I was planning on making my own but at those prices I won't bother. I'm down for one for sure. If you think about it, that solid bar doesn't need to be that thick I'd think 3/4" would be just fine. As far as the plates go, I'd be uneasy about 1/8" simply because of how the blocks are attached. I'd think 3/16" might be just right, 1/4" might be excessive. I'd also think about dogeared corners on the plates, that's just extra metal/weight that's not really serving any structural function because you've got the two fastening points holding it square. Plus with your CNC program, it'll optimize the cuts for the least waste, might be less metal used in the end which would drop the materials cost a little as well. Just my thoughts on it. Keep us updated. Thanks. I would think we could get 10-25 people down for these, they're the best design I've seen yet.

-Rob

jp314 · Nov 8th, 2002, 09:50 AM

"I'd think 3/4" would be just fine"
I'm planning on making one 3/4" and one 7/8", then compare them. The 1" solid hex is overkill, I think.

"I'd be uneasy about 1/8" simply because of how the blocks are attached. I'd think 3/16" might be just right, 1/4" might be excessive."
I was only thinking of 1/8" with steel, but I agree, that might be a little too thin. With Aluminum, I think 1/4" would be good, that bracket in aluminum will only be about 0.5 lbs.

"I'd also think about dogeared corners on the plates"
Yep - I was planning on this too.

Also - with this design, it really only needs to have a lock nut on one side.
I also plan to shorten the center bar and add more threads on the side that gets the lock nut.

vladha · Nov 8th, 2002, 07:49 PM

What Toolapcfan said... I don't even care how many other people buy them. For that little(ok, it's not pocket change, but still...) amount of money, it'd be worth it to have someone professional do it. Who knows how badly I'd mess it up... just look what I did to my car when I did a tune up.

I'm in... super thanks to Omer for for the original design.

Later,
Mark(big strong steriod gorilla arms, brain size of bacterium)

sno · Nov 8th, 2002, 08:56 PM

i'd be interested in one. my email is yellow_sno@hotmail.com

Joshb13sentra · Nov 8th, 2002, 10:14 PM

Pretty sweet bar, I'm in. Save me the pain of welding my own.
Thanks
Josh

tlSeR20DE · Nov 10th, 2002, 02:36 PM

i'm interested! lemme know how the final product comes out! email at: vtek63@hawaii.rr.com

thanks!
travis

sunnysentra · Nov 11th, 2002, 10:07 AM

I am interested with the rear strut brace.

Chris Droste
HCDROSTE@AOL.COM
1992 SE

Russellc · Nov 12th, 2002, 08:06 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by jp314
As far as finish goes, with an all aluminum brace, I'll just leave the finish as is. With steel brackets, I could get them zinc plated, without too much more expense.

Here's a copy of an e-mail I just sent to the se-r list:

> From: "Kevin J. Hart" <bowlcut@comcast.net>
> But will the seat fit back over that bar without any modifcations? And how
> noticeable is it? Omer's seat goes on no problem and the bar isnt
> noticeable

The seat fits back in place fine. You don't notice
it's there, unless you push back into the seat real
hard - It would probably be the same with Omer's.
Omer - care to try it?
The bar doesn't stick out past the 'seat mount
flange' much at all. I'm also going to use 7/8" or
3/4" hex in the final design.

> From: RCKTPWR@aol.com
> Has anyone actually put one of these bars on, and if so, have you felt any
> difference in the handling?

I have only driven home and back to work since installing
it, so I'm not sure yet.
Read this thread:
http://www.sr20deforum.com/showthrea...threadid=28785

"These make a pretty big differance. The rear of a b13 is about as stiff as a noodle. A sun roof makes it even worse." - Joel W. (random thoughts)

"You are exactly right. It made a *very* noticable difference. The car understeers much less and will hold a line much better. I can even get the car to drift now rather than plow, but the rest of my suspension obviously helps with that also."
- Omer Khan

> From: Butterglry@aol.com
> does the sheet metal bracket have to be 3/8 or can i get away with 1/8
> stainless?my konig front bar is pretty thin so i really dont see the need
> for the extra weight.

I used 5/16" thick with counterbored holes for the flange
nuts because that's the closest size we had in stock.
The final design will be 3/16" or 1/8" steel, or 1/4"
aluminum with c'bored holes for the flange nuts.
Also, look at your front bar. If it's like the 'Courtesy'
front STB, the brackets are stampings, with formed ridges.
These add a lot of strength, allowing the use of thin
sheet metal. The center bar is solid aluminum hex bar,
it is pretty rigid.

Estimated weights for complete brace:
Steel brackets, blocks:
w/ 3/4" hex Al bar = 6.5 lbs.
7/8" = 7.3 lbs.
1" = 8.2 lbs.
Aluminum brackets, blocks:
w/ 3/4" hex Al bar = 3.9 lbs.
7/8" = 4.7 lbs.
1" = 5.6 lbs.

The first one was made on manual equipment, with higher
quantities, we'll use the CNC's and will be much faster.
Ballpark pricing so far:
5 @ $85, 10 @ $65, 25 @ $55, 50 @ $50.
I think we can make them for less - if there's enough
interest, I'll have the CNC programs written and have
a better estimate on the price.

Josh Palmer
1993 SE-R

Please include me, I would like such a device.

Cheers, Russellc